Its interesting that Chili's pole time at Assen WSB round would have put him
11th on the Assen MotoGP grid. (Weather for practice and qualifying was
almost identical to the GP round.)
He was quicker than Ukawa, Hayden, Bayliss, Kagayama, and Hopkins, amongst
others. On a heavier 2 year old Ducati superbike with 50 less horsepower.

In <bjqqqb$kl11t$(E-Mail Removed)> "Steve" wrote:
> Its interesting that Chili's pole time at Assen WSB round would have
put him
> 11th on the Assen MotoGP grid. (Weather for practice and qualifying was
> almost identical to the GP round.)
> He was quicker than Ukawa, Hayden, Bayliss, Kagayama, and Hopkins,
amongst
> others. On a heavier 2 year old Ducati superbike with 50 less
horsepower.
>

He is a quick guy and knows Assen very well. Don't forget, he was in the
GP500 too (and won a wet race in Italy 92(?) where Rainey/Schwantz et.al
said they will not participate in a wet race.... shame on them)

Henry

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In <r-(E-Mail Removed)> "Mark N" wrote:
>
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:bjrita$mj53a$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > In <bjqqqb$kl11t$(E-Mail Removed)> "Steve" wrote:
> > > Its interesting that Chili's pole time at Assen WSB round would
have
> > put him
> > > 11th on the Assen MotoGP grid. (Weather for practice and qualifying
was
> > > almost identical to the GP round.)
> > > He was quicker than Ukawa, Hayden, Bayliss, Kagayama, and Hopkins,
> > amongst
> > > others. On a heavier 2 year old Ducati superbike with 50 less
> > horsepower.
>
> > He is a quick guy and knows Assen very well. Don't forget, he was in
the
> > GP500 too (and won a wet race in Italy 92(?) where Rainey/Schwantz
et.al
> > said they will not participate in a wet race.... shame on them)
>
> Chili's win at Misano came in '89, and every factory rider except him
(and
> part-time teammate Fred Merkel) boycotted the restart of that race. If
it

....YUP, 89, time runs.

> wasn't his home GP he would have done the same, I'm sure. That boycott
was
> ostensibly because the track surface was said to be particularly dodgy
in
> the wet, to the point of being unridable, and none of the riders had
had any
> wet time in there that weekend. The race was stopped because of the
rain 4-5
> laps in, and they were expected to just slap on some rains and go at
it. But
> the larger issue of safety and rider input had been brewing for some
time,
> and it just exploded that weekend. Although probably fully legitimate,
the
> rain was just an excuse in the end.
>

But anyhow, I was a little bit disappointed. There are definitely guys
out there, who are and were able to go for a wet race, even it is a
200++HP GP bike like today.
(Rossi e.g., same to Mike Doohan, I saw him sliding in a wet race over
both wheels out of the corners!)

> Anyway, Assen is an unusual track, requiring stringing together a
series of
> corners, usually at pretty high speed, but not at all stop-and-go, and
not
> even really a top speed track. In that sense it has things in common
with
> Donington (part of it anyway), and that's another track that has seen
some
> pretty quick times by SBs. Those kind of tracks reward experience and a
> certain kind of smooth precision in riding, and are less tilted toward
raw
> machine capability. SBs have gotten to be very good racing machines,
sharing
> many components like tires and suspension with their GP cousins, so
> generally aren't that far off.
>

I strongly believe that the future will melt SB and GP's together. Where
is the difference between both? They're coming closer and closer, -in
five years we will most likely have supersports and GP bikes, no SB. May
be I am wrong, time will show.

> What I would be interested in is seeing what the Kawasaki, Aprilia and
> Suzuki GP bikes would do in SB. They certainly aren't in the same class
as
> the other machines in GP (all except Edwards' Aprilia more than two
seconds
> a lap slower than Rossi in the race at Estoril). Edwards' Assen
qualifying
> time this year was 2:00.579 (9th), and last year he took SP with a
2:01.743.
> Bayliss was 3rd with a 2:01.913, and he was 13th in MotoGP this year
with a
> 2:01.147. Lavilla's Suzuki was 7/10ths slower than Hopkins; the fastest
GP
> Kawi posted the same time as Lavilla. Capirossi took pole this year
with a
> 1:59.77 on his Ducati, better than a second faster than Chili, who was
in
> turn more than a second quicker than he was last year.
>
> Btw, Mladin was nearly a second faster than Chili's best qualifying
time at
> Laguna (where he's been racing since '88 and certainly has more laps
in),
> and 1.3 seconds faster than Lavilla. So where does that put him
compared to
> the GP guys?
>

Back to Chili I believe he has lost the willing to go really fast after
his serious crash (was it Salzburgring in Austria??) where he survived a
top speed crash on a GP500. When I remember correctly this was his last
year in GP. After returning to SB he never was one of those candidates
for a champion ship. Maybe Foggy was too dominating, and now Chili is too
old.

Henry

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In <9PednTX-ZatbTvyiU-(E-Mail Removed)> "Mark N" wrote:
>
> Doohan was there that day, and didn't race. The two HB guys raced
because
> they were ordered to do so by their sponsor. Again, it wasn't about
racing
> in the rain in general.
>

That' right. This race was definitely no normal race. But doesn't all the
teams do those little tricks?
For Moto GP changing the rule that the race can only be stopped by the
officials is from my side highly appreciated. It was remarkable that
always the leaders of a champion ship raised their hands when the first
drops fell, if they where in the lead, or at least the ranking was not
brought in any disorder.

For me it is quite interesting how the riders perform, when the bike
doesn't make the big difference.

> The difference that matters at the moment is street production vs.
> prototype. SBs are necessary because the national championships need
> something to race, and it has to be reasonably cheap. WSB has no idea
what
> they think they are about right now, and instead of being an asset for
the
> class they now are a heavy burden on it. My guess has been that SB may
> transition to 600s eventually, but will certainly transition to more
"stock"
> machines. The question at the moment is what they will do in an effort
to
> keep twins in it. The AMA certainly seems focused on at least trying to
do
> that.

But is this not the same conclusion than mine? SuperSports 600 for
national competitions? Here in Germany they are quite common, because
affordable. Only minor changes allowed that doesn't cost a fortune. The
WSB has no future, at least looking 5 years forward, my opinion. I also
question what is about GP250 and GP125? After this obvious advantage
racing with 4 strokes, it is a matter of time when they also move from 2
strokes to 4 strokes in GP250/125. Than again, what is going to happen
with SuperSports??? (e.g. Changing GP250 to 500ccm 4 strokes...)

> I think you're talking about his crash at Blanchimont at Spa in '90
(which
> opened up a 500 spot for Sir Carl temporarily).

I am not sure, I have to dig in my video tapes.

> That was his last year in
> 500, but he did three years in 250 after that and was one of the
> frontrunners there. I don't know that I'd agree that the Spa crash was
some
> sort of epiphany, at least I haven't seen any evidence of it. Anyway,
he
> moved over to WSB because that was the best ride available at the time.

Wasn't the crash not at a section where normally nothing happens? That
was the reason for my understanding why no video exist. It was a
high-speed section without any attraction. Anyhow I believe Chili never
felt really comfortable on 2 strokes. I had the chance to talk to him in
the pits '95 in Assen. My impression was, SB is his beloved racing class.

> It
> took several years before he managed to land on the Corse team, and he
was a
> legit championship candidate in '98 - he won five races that year
(champ
> Fogarty only won three) and ended up 4th, I believe. Then on to Suzuki,
> where he was the only Suzuki rider to ever win a WSB race, other than
at
> Sugo. I think Chili was/is an inspired guy on occasion, but overall
isn't
> quite real championship caliber. But maybe it was just luck and too
little
> opportunity in the end. Still, he's maintained his competitiveness
> admirably.

Agree.

--

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