You know how the Majesty Shop Manual is real finicky about removing
the battery or at least removing the (-) terminal even when doing a 12v/.8a
"trickle" charge, it makes me wonder how we haven't burn't out all our
bike's main fuse with all the other ways we charge the GT9B-4 and generics.

I have an AGM that can be "quick charged" to 12v/5amps in 1 hour,
and have charged at 12v/6amps for which I always take the (-) terminal
off...

I don't have a pluggin parking for Optimas and C-tek reg/tricklers,
so I still do it the manual way. Charging at 12v/1.5ah does the job for
constant chargers, and takes it to 15+ volts if you think it works better
past the 15volt limit.

I am considering an Optima charger with 20ft extension cord to drop
from my other apartment's 2nd floor, but I wonder about the Majesty Shop
Manual caution of removing the battery or at least removing the (-) terminal
in conjunction with the Optima 14.4volt limit charger.

You can do all the Volt/Amp/Watt math and say it's safe, but you
always wonder if there's something you left out which might by-pass the
40amp main fuse and burn your yamaha majesty scooter's electronics....

The "Permanently" terminal fixed Batt. terminal setup is a good
idea, since removing cowling A is a bit of a hassle after awhile, but the
rectifier has a 14.9 no-load volt limit but that's just mostly stator to
battery use, and if you wanna go with a 15 volt charge, trickle chargers
don't take that chance for that reason and take a "float" route
instead....right?

Still, sitting around for 5-6 hours for a battery to charge and
top-pu is a it of a draagggg for street parkers.

I've never heard of anything going wrong with Optima type chargers,
but that's still trickle, and a lot of AGM will allow 1 hour charges instead
of a 5 hour reg/trickle charge....so many decisions pending on one's limited
"storage" *situation*.

Bob

On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 21:09:32 -0700, Bob <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

|> I've never heard of anything going wrong with Optima type chargers,
|>but that's still trickle, and a lot of AGM will allow 1 hour charges instead
|>of a 5 hour reg/trickle charge....so many decisions pending on one's limited
|>"storage" *situation*.

Correction
Should read:

I've never heard of anything going wrong with Optima type chargers,
but that's still trickle, and a lot of AGM will allow *5* hour charges
instead of a 1 hour reg/trickle charge....so many decisions pending on one's
limited "storage" *situation*.

ThanX

Bob wrote:

> Still, sitting around for 5-6 hours for a battery to charge and
> top-pu is a it of a draagggg for street parkers.
>

Does this machine NOT have an alternator ??
If so, how about fixing it so that you don't NEED a charger at all ???

Beyond that, 12V is 12V. The battery makes a good filter for spikes.
I wouldn't worry........when you actually need a charge.

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:11:43 -0500, "Who Me?" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

|>Bob wrote:
|>
|>> Still, sitting around for 5-6 hours for a battery to charge and
|>> top-pu is a it of a draagggg for street parkers.
|>>
|>
|>Does this machine NOT have an alternator ??
|>If so, how about fixing it so that you don't NEED a charger at all ???
|>

Yeah the stator/gerator/alternator works well, to the point that it
consumes any ambient RF waves around the scoot......in short, my remote
parking "clicker" doesn;t work too well until I turn the bike off....

I'm using/experimenting with a Chinese AGM, and have had it for a
year....I don't ride regularly and it's mostly city stuff....I get 14volts
at 5,000rpm but city is about 4,000rpm on a "CVT" tranny.

|>Beyond that, 12V is 12V. The battery makes a good filter for spikes.
|>I wouldn't worry........when you actually need a charge.
|>

AGMs have less internal resistance than "wet" SLA, but generally
they are similar in operation even though the construction is a totally
different concept.

Here's a 12/6v Chart

State of Charge
Specific Gravity
Voltage


12V
6V

100%
1.265
12.7
6.3

*75%
1.225
12.4
6.2

50%
1.190
12.2
6.1

25%
1.155
12.0
6.0

Discharged
1.120
11.9
6.0

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 22:20:18 -0700, Dennis Lee Bieber
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

|>On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:11:43 -0500, "Who Me?" <(E-Mail Removed)>
|>declaimed the following in alt.scooter:
|>
|>>
|>> Does this machine NOT have an alternator ??
|>> If so, how about fixing it so that you don't NEED a charger at all ???
|>>
|> If it is anything like my dung beetle, one would have to spend an
|>hour at cruise to do anything... Stop&Go city traffic won't do it --
|>idling at a light draws the voltage down to ~11, and it takes over two
|>blocks for the voltmeter to rise back to 13.7 (don't turn on the low
|>beam, that drops the voltages 0.2V)

Sounds about right here too.......

I looked at a lot a chargers (battery tender jr/plus), with the
terminal rings, but those rings are 18" and too short for any real use on a
majesty. without adding on some length and stuff, but still a trickle
charger is not too interesting in my situation, that is I can't leave it
charging overnight like some fortunate ppl can.

On Jun 25, 8:50*pm, Bob <r...@armageddon.info> wrote:
> On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 22:20:18 -0700, Dennis Lee Bieber
>
> <wlfr...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> |>On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:11:43 -0500, "Who Me?" <hitchhi...@dont.panic>
> |>declaimed the following in alt.scooter:
> |>
> |>>
> |>> Does this machine NOT have an alternator ??
> |>> If so, how about fixing it so that you don't NEED a charger at all ???
> |>>
> |> * If it is anything like my dung beetle, one would have to spend an
> |>hour at cruise to do anything... Stop&Go city traffic won't do it --
> |>idling at a light draws the voltage down to ~11, and it takes over two
> |>blocks for the voltmeter to rise back to 13.7 (don't turn on the low
> |>beam, that drops the voltages 0.2V)
>
> * * * * So theoretically, if (idling at a light draws the voltagedown to
> ~11) if you stayed there, it would sulfate the battery and you wouldn't be
> able to restart.....are you sure your charger is working right......AFAIK
> this shouldn't be happening....
>
> * * * * I'm not too sure about mine at *stop lights*, since I don't have an
> onboard voltmeter on the Yamy Majesty, but those 2 120watt halogens are a
> big suck that you can't turn off in bright daytime for some battery charging
> power. *

$12 or so at Kragen auto parts buys you a 6 LED
"alternator battery tester" that gives you a pretty
good idea of voltage. I've had one permanently installed
on the switched 12 volt circuit of my bike for years.

Are you really sure you've got a pair of 120 watt
headlights installed ? If that's really true, an HID
conversion would be a big power savings (at a
fancy price). I seriously doubt 240 watts of stock
lighting though. My bet would be under 100 watts.

Dennis Lee Bieber wrote:

> Aye... I'd have to run a 100 foot extension cord from the laundry
> room to my parking stall to do trickle charging...
>

Maybe you should look into a solar trickle charger.
The capacity is REALLY low but it might be enough to keep you
going.......assuming that someone doesn't steal it.....since it has to be
out in the open.

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 23:02:13 -0700 (PDT), Rob Kleinschmidt
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

|>
|>Are you really sure you've got a pair of 120 watt
|>headlights installed ? If that's really true, an HID
|>conversion would be a big power savings (at a
|>fancy price). I seriously doubt 240 watts of stock
|>lighting though. My bet would be under 100 watts.

Right, 2X60 watts = 120 watts, then there's all the other lights...

Maybe the Gorilla alarm leeches off some power, but some say it
isn't much unless you install the pilot light as well, which I
disconnected.

But then, I'm using a Chinese AGM, not the usual GS GT9B-4 (Wet
cell vrla sla) type after I got a shorted cell with my last $215.00 GS one
month after the warranty expired.

I do have the original 5 year old GS GT9B-4 battery I use for jump
starts, since it can't hold much of a charge.

HID need more volts then all halogens and without the booster kit,
they would kill most 8amp batteries at startup.

R. LaCasse wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 23:02:13 -0700 (PDT), Rob Kleinschmidt
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> |>
> |>Are you really sure you've got a pair of 120 watt
> |>headlights installed ? If that's really true, an HID
> |>conversion would be a big power savings (at a
> |>fancy price). I seriously doubt 240 watts of stock
> |>lighting though. My bet would be under 100 watts.
>
> Right, 2X60 watts = 120 watts, then there's all the other lights...
>
> Maybe the Gorilla alarm leeches off some power, but some say it
> isn't much unless you install the pilot light as well, which I
> disconnected.
>
> But then, I'm using a Chinese AGM, not the usual GS GT9B-4 (Wet
> cell vrla sla) type after I got a shorted cell with my last $215.00 GS one
> month after the warranty expired.
>
> I do have the original 5 year old GS GT9B-4 battery I use for jump
> starts, since it can't hold much of a charge.
>
> HID need more volts then all halogens and without the booster kit,
> they would kill most 8amp batteries at startup.


120 watts is a lot for a smallish scoot/bike (I'd guess the Majesty 400
has about a 300 or 400 watt alternator). Assuming I've done my
arithmetic right (never guaranteed with me) 120 watts would drain a new
10AH battery in about an hour and an older one in probably much less.
In winter (near you in the northwest) when there's snow and ice I
sometimes go a month or more without riding. I figure it's enough to
charge my batteries for four or five hours at two amps or less, about
every two weeks but sometimes I go as much as much as month. I always
get at least five years out of a battery, both good Yuasa's and cheap
no-names, on my smallish scoots (70cc, 250cc, plus a few bigger ones I
don't have anymore). The cool or cold temps in winter are actually good
for storing batteries and it rarely gets as hot here as in, say,
southern California or Arizona.


Just for a quick test, I'd check the voltage drop across the Gorilla's
connectors when it's armed and then roughly calculate the current draw,
a one volt drop would be about a 0.1 amp draw. Or if the documentation
says it uses 2 or 3 watts when on, that would be roughly 0.1 or 0.2 amp
draw, which could run down a smallish bike battery in three or four
days. That might change my rough guidelines above and maybe you'd have
to charge once a week. It rarely gets freezing cold here, so the only
drag is getting wet when you remove it from the carpark.


I had a Suzuki Burgman 400 and a Vespa 250 and both of them charged at
idle, with the lights on. Lots of smaller bikes will charge at idle, I
presume because the designers know they're going to be used in
stop-and-go conditions, so they put in a slightly bigger alternator,
even though this hurts brake horsepower. If I were in the habit of
leaving the lights on for some reason, with the engine off, I think I'd
wire an on/off switch to the headlight circuit.


Another possible reason for running batteries down is whether you have
run-time accessories going, such as heaters.

paul c wrote:
> R. LaCasse wrote:
....

Oh, another thought, since you have a second battery, you could prolong
the time between charges in the winter months by putting it in the
storage compartment and wiring it in parallel with the main battery,
then you might get a few more days with the Gorilla alarm armed.