Advice needed; sidecar jockying.

So, thanks to Grandpa Skeletor posting a link to an eBay auction[1] I
find myself the proud owner of a 1980 Kwack Z500 coupled to a Velorex
sidecar.

My discussion with Champ shortly after buying it showed my degree of
thought before bidding:
"it's a four cylinder bike, right."
"Dunno, did they make a two cylinder or was that the 400?"

Anyway, what's done is done.

It's what's about to be done that causes me some concern.

I've got to collect the fucker. Now, I could borrow some farm machinery
and load the thing onto a trailer and drag it home; but it's a hundred
miles and I hate towing things. So my alternative is to ride it. Given
the plan is to pilot it for over 1000 miles into the winter time raid to
the father land I think I need to start learning.

I've some experience of riding a combination; Platy's for about two
minutes, maybe five. How hard can it be? I know there's a steering
effect when you accelerate/brake and that it needs steering rather than
countersteering but that's about the limit of my knowledge.

Do I need to know more or is that enough coupled to 25+ years of riding
bikes/driving cars; actually 35+ years if I include tractors.

The plan, if you can call it that, is to turn up on Saturday morning and
ride it home via the M5/M6. The vendor reckons it's safe at speeds of
up to 70[2]...

I'll stop rambling and pose my questions:


1. Am I unhinged to ride the bike home.

2. Do I need to know more than:
2.1 Accelerate and it goes away from the kerb.
2.2 Brake and it goes towards the kerb.
2.3 No leading link forks means hard work steering
2.4 Top speed 70mph[3]

3. Should I avoid motorways?


That's it. Answers from people who've actually driven sidecars would be
much appreciated. Advice from Sweller specifically sought (so I know
what not to do.)



[1] 130150643103
[2] Unlike me. "Unsafe at any speed"
[3] Oh, I doubt that very much...

 

Can we come along and spectate?

 

I may stop at Prescott for the hill climb.

 

Towards kerb

Centre line

Steering? Hope springs eternal.

60 ish

No - makes it easier. Just avoid slip roads with a right hand chair.

 

Coming from you that's not really reassuring.

Check. I had typed "towards chair" and then reworded.

Oh, I very much doubt that. It's like a "safe working load" thing isn't
it. However I suppose the cruising speed may be lower than 70.

I've a left hand chair so job done.

 

On Sun, 16 Sep 2007 11:53:53 +0100, wrote:

snip>

Why are you bothering to ask this question?

I don't know the answer to any of the questions but surely you just
get on it and whack it open then wait to see what happens?

I think you need to top speed test it asap and motorways are ideal for
the task.

I'm looking forward to next January more and more every day.

 

expressed precisely :

Towards the kerb.

Away from the kerb.

Be very careful on the left hand turns, centrifugal force will tend to
lift the sidecars wheel off the road. Perhaps add a sack of something
heavy to help hold it down.

Remember trying to lean the bike doesn't steer it, you have to turn the
bars.

 

A proper attitude.

 

These two are the wrong way round, so maybe I'll rethink (1).

 

I set them up, others knock them down I guess.

Well, that's the basic plan.

Well, yes. But let me get used to it so probably about four miles after
I enter the motorway I'll go into a death wobble.

Me too.

 

(The Older Gentleman) wrote in
message

Ah, it'll be fine. Within five miles I won't be thinking what to do,
I'll have learnt it.

It's what puzzles me about steering/countersteering, at some speed you
switch from one to the other, how do you know when? My assumption is
it's a feedback loop, you countersteer and go the wrong direction then
steer and all's well; I'm certainly not conscious of this and assume
it's because my mind works it out at an unconscious level (i.e.
unconsciously competent).

 

PoP - just watch for Armco.
--
Dave
GS850x2 XS650 SE6a

Teach a man to fish and he and his pikey mates will have the
river cleaned out in a day.

 

Generally, I find the degree of arsehole pucker to be an infallible
guide.

 

Would you like me to come along with you and sit in the chair, shouting
abuse? My considerable mass should help minimise aviation, too.

 

make sure to video the ride.

 

I need to give the Guzzi a gentle test run too - I could follow with a
camera.

 

No entries on the day unfortunately, because they are usually short of
sidecar/three-wheeler entries and the crowd love them apparently;-)

Want lessons on the (grass) car park during the lunch break?

Hopefully the seller has set up tyre pressures correctly. Even so you
may notice an unsettling steering wobble at 30mphish. Even with a
steering damper this can still occur on the best set up outfits. It will
pass if you accelerate smartly through it arms suitably braced. If the
front tyre pressure is too high it may not pass as in the case of my
Mille GT/Squire when I test rode it prior to riding it home from Berwick
on Tweed to Wolverhampton. It was just a case of a dealer unfamiliar
with outfits who had pumped up the 18 inch front Avon to sports bike
pressure.

It is surprising how little speed you need to get in to 'opposite lock'
mode if you give it the beans on a right hander, as you may have found
on platy's device (only in reverse).

When I had the G80C/Watsonian I rode it from preliminary chair marriage
work to my mates garage some miles away with him perched on a piece of
4x4 lashed between the bike and the sidecar suspension upper mounting.
This was because we had rescued the chair from scrap and were going to
have to completely rebuild the body.

On a trials universal rear, with him dangling out like a TT racer we had
the chair lifting and the back tyre sliding at the same time.


--

+-------------------------------------------------------------+
| Pete Fisher at Home: |
| Voxan Roadster Gilera Nordwest Yamaha WR250Z |
| Gilera GFR * 2 Moto Morini 2C/375 |
+-------------------------------------------------------------+

 

That's a kind offer but I'm shy and would rather make a twat of myself
without witnesses. If you want to laugh I'll stop at Prescott at some
point around mid-day; to change underpants and stop shaking.

However, mentioning bulk, what's this all about then. If there isn't
weight in the chair it'll be easier to lift when cornering but are there
other reasons for having weight there?

 

I'll probably be there on the Ural - we can terrify people together.

Just to avoid undesired aviation. If you turn toward the chair, the
tendency is for the chair to lift.

How good is your understanding of outfit behaviour?

 

Towards the chair = lift? Blimey, I'd have thought it was away from the
chair.

Well, you've seen the full extent of my outfit experience.