Allied Forces?

Veggie Dave wrote

Not WWII as such no but given the way the Nazis saw the world organized
he would have been obliged to invade somewhere at some time else he
would never have achieved the world domination that was his gaol.

 

To be fair they had been building up a *massive* invasion force on the
borders of the then Japanese empire for a long time. The atomic bomb was
just a "fortunate" co-incidence. There is speculation that the US knew the
Japs were going to surrender, and dropped the bomb on Nagasaki as a warning
to the Russians to back off. After all, the Russians didn't know how many
more bombs they had at the time.

 

One of my mother's neighbors had a UXB in a bathtub after one air raid.
(People commonly filled bathtubs and other containers with water in case
there wasn't any afterwards.) Eventually many families were evacuated to
the countryside to escape the bombings. My grandmother lost her night
vision during the war because of malnutrition.

 

Maybe WWII wouldn't have been kicked off had Germany not been blamed for
the Great War and burdened with economically ruinous war debts.
Meanwhile, everybody was ready to fight WWII. There had been treaties
after the Great War which limited the size and number of battleships
that countries were allowed to build, but one by one countries all
quietly abandoned the treaty and built warships anyway.

 

Grandmother had an air raid shelter in her back garden. It was still there
when I was a child, albeit filled in and with roses planted on the top. The
chap who now lives in the house had the devil of a job getting rid of the
thing. Mother was at the Windmill Theatre all through the war - and lost her
eyebrows and eyelashes trying to put out an incendiary bomb. Pa was wounded,
badly, at Cassino in 1943. Still suffers from the after effects. Dave's Pa
worked - reserved occupation - in Devonport Dockyard through the war, and
reckoned he'd have been safer as a soldier. Dave's mother filled shell
casings. My late uncle's family all died in the extermination camps, bar one
old aunt who escaped on a train across Russia. It's all very real to me.

Ali

 

Timberwoof wrote

Yeah my Grandmother stopped going out at night when the yanks went home
too.

It never seemed to stop her being able to lay her hands on a bottle of
Gin though. Most peculiar that was.

 

Alison Hopkins wrote

Mine also.

Air Ministry during the day doing liaison stuff with merkin forces

and there in the evenings doing similar sorts of things. I don't care
what my Grandmother says she was obviously loyal to the cause. Perhaps
they knew each other?

She went to Somerset in 43.

The man my mother says I must call father spent half the war in Jamaica
playing cricket and getting pissed.

I also.

 

Alison Hopkins says...

As a punishment for being naughty kids my mum used to make us eat half a
raw potato or a handful of rice, because she wanted us to know what it
was like for kids on Malta during the war[1].

We used to look forward to it because if she'd taken the trouble to cook
the potatoes or rice they'd have been burnt or worse. She's a fucking
lousy cook, I joined the army at 16 because they fed me better.

[1] **** only knows why we'd need to know that just because we'd been
naughty. The twisted logic of a Maltese parent I suppose.

 

I used to think that way, until I read a bit more deeply around the subject.
In fact, Germany was already potless as a result of the Kaiser spending so
heavily on munitions, ships etc - and also because the British naval
blockade of the North Sea meant that all supplies had to come in overland
and at huge expense. That was rather the reason that the generals finally
went to the Kaiser and told him that further prosecution of the war was
economically and logistically impossible. Soldiers were starting to mutiny
along the lines because of starvation and arrears of pay. Germany was about
to collapse, and the generals and cabinet ministers feared a bloody
revolution, as had happened in Russia the previous winter.

The post-war reparations, while certainly punitive as the French sought
revenge for both WW1 and the Franco-Prussian War of 1870-1, merely
exacerbated an already fragile economy. Consequence: hyper-inflation. Then
coincident worldwide depression. Consequence: Hitler.

 

But only dumbfuck rednecks believe that one, as compared to historical
events that actually took place.

If you are able to handle complicated words, try reading "Empire", by Niall
Ferguson, and perhaps you won't make quite such a tit of yourself
afterwards.

 

Nothing to do with securing his eastern flank against non-interference
while he did over Poland, then? And yes, he was *always* going to attack
Russia.

So why say: "the reason for Hitler invading Europe was a rouse (you mean
ruse, I take it) to get Russia involved,"

Because that was, is and always will be bollocks. Sorry.

 

I thought the Allies approached him, but as you say, we played our cards
so badly anyway that he took Hitler's deal, as you say.

 

The Versailles Treaty was nasty and vindictive, agreed.

Not quite true. The 1920s treaty to scrap battleships was one of those
rare arms limitations treaties which worked. People really did scrap
them.

People (well, Britain, mainly) only started building them again when it
was obvious that Germany was re-arming.

Japan is a separate case altogether.

 

We've still got one in ours, in perfect 'operational' order, as anyone
who's visited The Chateau can testify.

 

The Older Gentleman says...

Wrong. I've been to The Chateau and hadn't a clue there was a shelter in
the back garden.

 

Huh ??? Hitler didn't know he'd have to fight on two
fronts when he invaded Russia ?

He may have been surprised by the Japanese attack
on Pearl Harbor but Russia seems to have been in
his plans for a long time.

 

When watching a re-run of the Cenotaph thing where the old codgers
march past, a back-of-a-fag packet calculation suggested that if the
Russian War dead marched past, six abreast, non-stop, they'd finish
sometime in mid-March.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/CBX1000Z
|_\_____/_| ..87845../..23037.../..31893.
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 WG*
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 PM#5
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4 YTC#4 two#11
'^' RBR Clues: 00 Pts:0000 Miles:0000

 

Not the most impartial book ever written. Tog'd love it.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \
_/_____\_ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/CBX1000Z
|_\_____/_| ..87845../..23037.../..31893.
(>|_|_|<) TPPFATUICG#7 DIAABTCOD#9 WG*
|__|_|__| BOTAFOT #70 BOTAFOF #09 PM#5
\ |^| / IbW#0 & KotIbW# BotTOS#6 GP#4
\|^|/ ANORAK#17 IbB#4 YTC#4 two#11
'^' RBR Clues: 00 Pts:0000 Miles:0000

 

Same here. When I was a nipper Father still had a dummy greande he used
for drill. I also found his Army issue revolver one day in the bottom
of a blanket box. By some miracle I didn't experiment with the live
amunition he also had come home with. I did eat the hashish he bought
home though [1]. He handed them in later during a firearms amnesty. A
pastel portrait of my late eldest sister, in pride of place on the
'sitting room' wall, had been done for him from a tiny photo by a
German PoW. Memories of taking a detail of them to clear the beach of
jellyfish so the British squaddies could swim at port Said was one of
his many reminiscences.

Still got his swagger stick and dress uniform and cap in the loft.

He was lucky or I wouldn't be here QED.

[1] Stomach pumped out - never the same again as you can tell

 

Grandy was a prisoner of war, captured in Italy. He died too young as
a result of the damage done then. It's just gone the anniversary -
first year that he's been dead longer than he was in my life. It's far
too real atm.