Chinese Imports - dirt bikes

Recently bought my 5yo a new Kawasaki KTX50. But I have seen a lot of
chines imports or copies for half the price of a "proper" bike.

Are these Cheap chinese imports inferior , what are your thoughts and
expereinces on there quailty?.

I basically figured you get what you paid for...

Zane

 

<shrug> It remains to be seen doesn't it ? They've only been in Oz for a
year or two. When you buy a bike you're buying a product but you're also
buying parts availability after sales service, warranty etc.

I'd hazard a guess that in 2 years time the KTX will be going strong,
the chinese copy may or may not be. On the other hand, a bit like kids
clothes, you don't really want to be spending big bucks on designer kit
because they'll grow out of them, so I suspect that in a few years time
the Chinese minibikes are going to be selling like hotcakes.

JL

 

110cc 4 stroke chinese mini bike experience...

The 12 year old boy (Jacob) rides the hell out of his, and his sisters
and his sisters boyfriend ride the hell out of it too.

It had frequent loose nuts and bolts syndrome and the original chain was
made of cheese.

Tightening most of the nuts and bolts... adding lock washers and
replacing the chain and it's now giving no trouble.

It goes well and the motor is basically a CT110 motor with shorter gearing.

Sumnmary... decent motors surrounded by average plastics and cheap
ancilleries.


G-S

 

I bought my son a $900 PeeWee 50 ripoff as his 1st bike, because I
didn't want to drop $2K on something that he may not be terribly
interested in.

The biggest problem with these bikes is actually the people selling
them. These bikes need a thorough pre-delivery session. Tighten all
nuts, correctly adjust everything, check electrical connections, etc.
etc.

Bike shops traditionally do an OK job of this, but Joe Schmuck
operating out of his garage (who's never seen a motorbike before) will
generally have problems, or simply not bother.

My son's bike seized (no apparent permanent damage) on a hot day
because of an incorrectly adjusted/primed oil pump. I also had
electrical connectors melt because they were arcing (not connected
properly). Now that it's 6+ months old, and I've been over everything 3
times, it's going like I'd expect a new bike to go.

His next bike will be either an XR or CRF, and I'll pass this one down
to my youngest son. If it lasts 2 kids, I figure it's $900 well spent.

 

neighbour bought one while back. it now doesnt work, it started
cracking the frame and all sorts of shit fell off it.

 

Heard that there is a Gov investigation into them happening and that Honda
have issued a statement distancing themselves from them as most think they
are Honda based

ck

 

I bought a 110cc chinese bike for my kids.
Some of the alloy threads in the motor and box in ours are very suspect, the
thread can come out with the screws. Happened with the clutch adjustment
cover in the side of the box.
Welding is very (note VERY) average, however, ours is still in one piece.
The swingarm on ours is too low relative to the gearbox output shaft and the
chain goes loose when the suspension is compressed, and the engine is also
not securely enough mounted into the frame, the steel mounts flex. I expect
this is not common to all chinese bikes though.
The decorative plastics on ours are not actually soft plastics but a more
brittle product that initially looks good but doesn't last long with a few
minor crashes.
The barb out of the plastic fuel tank is also plastic on ours, (far better
plastic in the tank then in the decorative plastics on the bike) and the
barb cracked partially through where it attaches to the tank. I drilled the
hole out in the tank and threaded it to fit a 1/4" BSP brass barb otherwise
a new tank was required.
Ours has electric start which always engages and the bike always starts very
easily.
I had to cut and reweld the rear brake pedal as my kids couldn't use it in
the position it was originally in.

CONCLUSION

It was cheap and you get what you pay for. Next time I am buying a Honda.

 

Correction, the swingarm is too HIGH relative tothe gearbox output shaft,
You adjust the chain with the bike on the stand and it goes loose as you
compress the suspension.

 

I had it right the first time, too low it is.

 

There are no copyright laws in china... Mercury outboards will suffer
next, they are moving their whole engine building to China for up to
60hp engines....

Cheap shit outboards coming to ebay in 12-24 mths

 

You sure about that?

You don't say!


Moike

 

That's not actually true, however the level of enforcement of
infringement is poorer, the enforcers are open to bribery and corruption
However many of the things you're referring to aren't actually subject
to legal protection from copying. The Honda CT family are entirely open
to being copied, legally, any patent protection they might have had (and
to be honest I doubt there ever was any), would have long since expired.
There's not very much new in engine design, very few things about a
modern engine are actually patentable. The last major ones IMNSHO were
the Orbital Engine 2 stroke technology (must get around to finding out
more about that - don't really know much about it), direct injection and
pneumatic valves , but there's not much that's protected in your average
bike. Industrial secrecy and the time it takes to reverse engineer a
design are the primary protection - hence why the new Hyosung motors are
basically clones of older Suzuki motors and quite legally so. It would
be illegal for them to sell them with a Suzuki badge on of course
("passing off").

<shrug> People said the same thing about the Japanese in the 50's and
60's - nowadays Toyota/Lexus (and Jaguar) regularly top the JD Powers
reliability surveys

<chuckle> Yeah that'd be like the all the other senate enquiries our
government ignores ? What's the enquiry you heard about with regard to
by the way ? The only thing that'd make since would be Consumer affairs
doing an investigation on fitness for purpose (if goods aren't compliant
with standards or not capable of performing the task for which they are
sold) - ie Trade Practises Act.

Of course, Honda have a very valuable brand, they don't want someone
selling Homda's or Hondda's or whatever, made in China and people
confusing them with the genuine article.

JL

 

Your neighbour bought one?

Those things are kids bikes... how much does he weigh and what one did
he get?


G-S

 

The mini bikes are very poorly made, they make a used jap mini bike look
real good.
A friend bought a 4 wheeler (new) to do some weed spraying from, it
developed a electrical problem after 3 months , when the importer was
asked to supply a wiring diagram , he recieved a photo of a wiring loom
lying stretched out on the floor.


Mick Chester

 

Ask lister diesels about copyright, they sent one engine to china. there
are millions of them in china now. not one made or sold by lister engine
company, not a penny of royalties , nothing.

Mick Chester

 

Care to explain on what legal basis they were (or could have been)
entitled to copyright on an engine ?

Might want to read this one

http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/doc/general/whatis.htm

What Is a Copyright?

Copyright is a form of protection provided to the authors of “original
works of authorship” including literary, dramatic, musical, artistic,
and certain other intellectual works, both published and unpublished.
The 1976 Copyright Act generally gives the owner of copyright the
exclusive right to reproduce the copyrighted work, to prepare derivative
works, to distribute copies or phonorecords of the copyrighted work, to
perform the copyrighted work publicly, or to display the copyrighted
work publicly.

The copyright protects the form of expression rather than the subject
matter of the writing. For example, a description of a machine could be
copyrighted, but this would only prevent others from copying the
description; it would not prevent others from writing a description of
their own or from making and using the machine.

JL
(they're not entitled to any other intellectual property protection
other than patents, and I doubt a Lister pump motor was patented)

 

More likely a registered design.

There probably are not too many active patents around for diesel
engines, except for some modern variations, perhaps injection systems (I
don't know much about deisels).

China is a signatory to the Paris Convention, so they could have
registered their design in China, but if they didn't they were a bit
silly sending one there.

Depending on when this all happened, they may still have a remedy, since
the Paris convention allows the home country priority date to apply in
the country where registration is sought.

Other companies have been quite successful in setting up manufacturing
subsidiaries or having their products manufactured under licence.

Audi, Ford, Jeep, Toyota, VW, Citroen, Buick, Chevrolet are just some of
the brands manufactured in China.

Moike

 

Nope, have done a little reading on Intellectual property.

Better be nice to you then...Always a good idea.

Moike

 

Failing that one can always ride away from him... he does ride a BMW
after all... [1]


G-S

[1] Admittedly it's the superbike model...

 

See the bit below my initials which answers that as well. The Lister
diesel pump engines utilising an 80 year old design are hardly
innovative engineering requiring patent protection.

Too many people think there's laws against copying things - that there's
some sort of inherent protection in having manufactured something and
hence no one is allowed to copy it which is a load of bollocks. Patents
are there to encourage investment in research, they're not there to
prevent competition

JL