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Coincidentally, I saw a test report on this type of product recently. One popular brand achieved between 1.4 and 2 seconds in the impact abrasion test. This is barely adequate for the parts of the body - and garment - that rarely touch the road surface in a slide (e.g. the inside of the thighs and the front of the abdomen), yet the aramid is present in the high risk areas of buttocks, sides of legs and knees! Another well-known brand achieved between 3.4 and 5.4 seconds, which is good enough for an EN 13595 Level 1 pass where the aramid is present. Performance where there is only denim still falls well below the standard's requirement, however. An experimental product achieved between 10.1 and 10.4 seconds. Good enough for the highest, Level 2 performance class of EN 13595 where the reinforcement fabric is present.
I once had a face-up slide at The Esses at Mallory. When my back started to get warm I turned over and finished face-down. Swift of Northampton made some jolly decent suits twenty-odd years ago!
The available data suggests they are significantly less common (see "Performance of Protective Clothing: Fifth Volume", published by ASTM).
Aye. Them t'were t'days. There seem to be a few of the original products still knocking around amongst ukrm-ers, some of whom have sadly discovered that leather shrinks with the passage of time, so they can no longer fit into garments which were perfectly sized a few years ago. ;-)
So, if you're going to wear normal jeans, these will give you a 'bit' more protection, but any feeling of 'protection' is fairly misguided? How does that compare with 'average' leathers? It sounds to me like these experimentals would be a good compromise between the ease of jeans and the effort of leathers, for those occasional jaunts? Any idea if these are likely to be on the market soon? -- Dnc B1200 - +30bhp ~|~ ZZR1100 - faster when upright V2300 - flat cap and rug ~|~ A6 2.5TDi V6 Quattro Sport MIB#26 two#54(soiled) UKRMMA#26 BOTAFOT#153 X-FOT#003
Oi! It's a medical problem... That's my story and I'm sticking to it. I had a low speed face down slide Summer before last. I slid about 45 feet wearing an Aerostich. The 'stich wasn't scuffed or damaged in any way. The only scuffing visible was on the back of one of my (leather) gloves. All the best, Tom
Now you know I won't, but i'll take your word on it ;-) I think I rolled the first time, and slid on my back the second (after landing on my shoulder) Am now dosing up on high strength calcium and always wearing decent boots to avoid further unnecessary damage ;-) Paul.
I have, and completely face down facnig forward. Also the only m/c accident I have had. Helmet scars and knee of the leather jeans mostly, on the RHS. Considering I came right off and over the bike at around 30Mph though, clearing the guys boot altogether, not an awful lot of damage at all. I think it helped also that I was wearing a pear of FOAD Timerblands, not your typical biking boot but did the job.
Wearing a layer of denim will increase the time before your own epidermis makes contact with the road surface, but not by much. "Average" leathers might be expected to record comparable times. The better equipment (leather or textile) would be expected to exceed 12 seconds. Some heavyweight leathers have been known to go past 20 seconds. In the experimental jeans, the reinforcement fabric would have to extend throughout the entirety of the jeans to meet the requirements of the standard. I really don't know. As I said, the test specimen was "experimental", but the manufacturer's plans might be swayed by the outcome. I doubt we could expect to see anything before next year, however. Generally, a product range is signed off around a year in advance. I know companies who had finalised their 2007 ranges in Autumn 2005!
I'm guessing fractions. So, if they were to make it to the shelves, they would be worth looking at for casual situations. Price tag depending of course. I guess it depends on the cost/margin really, and of course how much damage it might do to their leathers/textiles business, if they cover that market. That said, if I could make them at a price/margin that encouraged sale, I'd love to clear up the market (at least initially) by having a product that trounced the competitors so heavily - with a standard to back it up. I've considered the likes of Draggin and Giali before, and frankly, didn't think they were worth the expense compared to the very minimal added protection over normal jeans. The type of figures above for "experimental" however, would make me consider further Thanks for the info/update
Thinking back, I generally land on one side or other, possibly with a bit of rag-dolling thrown in. I landed on my chin once, but that was long ago and in another country. Also, platy's law of waking up in the gutter states that face down is drunk, face up is fell off. Giali's UK premises are just down the road from me - "Radiant House" was formerly the shop of IIRC Radiant Domestic Appliances...
I wouldn't *dare* to contest anything you post on this subject, especially as I know nothing about it. But I do wonder how relevant the impact abrasion figures are for *road* riding. Surely in most road crashes you either hit another vehicle & stop very quickly, or get deflected off into something else that stops you very quickly, or drop it going round a bend & slide off into a hedge/wall/tree/verge. The number of road crashes where you'd slide on tarmac for more than 2 seconds seems like it'd be very, very small to me. I've had 5 crashes on the road; 2 SMIDSYs with cars, 1 SMIDSY with a flock of sheep, 1 bend covered with black ice & 1 roundabout covered with diesel. I'm fairly sure I didn't slide along the road for more than a second in any of them. Having said that, I would've had a lengthy slide up the M25[1] yesterday if I'd hit the pile of breeze blocks sat in the road, so there's always an exception! [1] Filtering's a tad nerve-wracking when the traffic's been stationary so long that most people have opened their doors, or are standing around next to their cars yacking. -- Krusty. http://www.muddystuff.co.uk http://www.muddystuff.us Off-road classifieds '02 MV Senna '03 Tiger (FOYRNB) '96 Tiger '79 Fantic 250
Hmm. I don't recall how long my knee was in contact with the tarmac for my first bike lob - but I still bear the gravel rash today. I had one accident on the M5/6 slip road where I got nudged off. I rolled and rolled for what seemed an eternity, but was in leathers and didn't have a scuff. Just a sprained ankle. IIRC, Paul will confirm, but denim will last less than a second. fucking truckers.
I admit to being lucky but on all three major offs I have slid rather than collided. Once was on farm track mud and grass verge so not a good test but onceon tarmac in Wolf leathers and once in HG cordura. Both did their job.
