Just so I don't...

Spend **** knows how long looking in the wrong place...

My brother asked me to collect and fix his bike (Bandit 1200 with the half
fairing thing)

Apparently this thing smokes and when I asked him to describe the smoke
(blue, black, white) he said it's blue and worse when he first starts it,
but it eases off although it doesn't clear completely. I'm not sure I
believe him when he says "Blue" coz he'll answer a question just so he
doesn't look like a **** by saying "I dunno, I never gave it a thought"
which is more likely to be the case as he's not exactly mechanically
inclined and wouldn't think the colour of the smoke was important.

He also says it runs rough but gets better as it warms up. So... I'm
thinking the first line of attack is the carbs (clean, check float heights
and balance) followed by valve stem oil seals if the carbs prove not to be
the problem. If it's not the valve stems oils seals, then it's going to be
the rings/bores which I really don't want to get into replacing but if needs
must and all that and I'll alread have the head off anyway.

Having never owned a Bandit, but plenty of shite stuff that smokes like
fucker when running rich, I'm wondering if this is a trait of the Bandit
(running rich and smoking).

This bike doesn't have a crankcase breather either, but it *did* have a
modified oil filler cap with a tube running up to the air box region where a
bottle collected any outpouring of oil which could then dribble back into
the bottom of the motor when it wasn't running. Cap now lost, but as it's
not standard anyway I really don't want to put another one like it back on.
I'd prefer to run a normal crankcase breather and will when I know where the
original would've been situated.

Idea's from the FONT?

 

@hurricane:

give it a full service, removing any "improvements" as you go

 

My first move would be to whip out the plugs, check colour, and do a
compression test. Serious shit like rings/bores will show up as a
black plug and low compression. Having eliminated the most expensive
options it then comes down to mixture or valve guides as you say.
If the smoke really is blue it means oil is being burnt.
A set of stem seals often makes a big difference - but you know all that.

 

What year is it? This may seem like a strange question, but there was
a fundamental change with the 'K' bikes (before the current
water-cooled engine) that gave rise to much smokiness with some of them.

I'd agree entirely with your thoughts: you'll have to eliminate
carburation problems first and it's the easiest starter offer, too. It
may, rather bizarrely, be worth dropping the exhaust off and checking
which pot(s) it is that's smoking: if he's habitually warmed it up on
the sidestand the leftmost is always favourite for a bit of borewash,
it seems, the rightmost for a bit of oil starvation, conversely.

All Bandits IME are set rich out of the factory. If the bike is on
standard can and filter it will run rich at small to medium throttle
openings, only getting anywhere near stochiometric at full chat. A bit
of black chuff now and again is fairly normal, but blue isn't, as you
know. White is right out of the question, unless the geezer's a senior
Cardinal - in which case he's also entitled to wear horns on his helmet.

The standard breather on all models runs to a spigot moulded into the
front centre top of the airbox. If that spigot hasn't been sealed once
the breather was disconnected then there's a fine source of rough
running. I think catch tank things like this, or worse, the nasty
little chromey filter-onna-hose jobbies are to be reviled and the users
of same to be mocked. Unless fitted to a race bike where cleanliness
of the air charge entering the air box is vital for mixture management,
of course - or if the bike has been properly modded and there isn't an
airbox any more; that's a good case for such contraptions.

Yeah, watch the apostrophes, fatty.

 

It's a 2002 air/oil cooled.

Yeah, they're going to get a cleaning anyway coz brother's a fucking animal
when it ocmes to looking after his stuff. I bet the air cleaner has never
seen the light of day either.

Good thinking. Exhaust header will be removed and hopefully all the fucking
studs will remain as studs and not as two-piece lumps of corroded shite.

Nope, some after market oval shaped chromey thing. No name that I can see.
Obviously not fitted by brother.

He swears it's not white and until the battery has a decent charge (it's on
charge as I type) I won't know for sure.

But where does it run *from*?

I'll be checking the airbox for open spigotry then

I had a could of spares and couldn't find a use for them, so I lobbed one
out and it found its way here

 

Sensible approach. It will be done.

 

Yeah, I just don't really want to get into removing the head and pistons,
but I will if I have no alternative. I was always under the impression that
Bandit motors were pretty bullet proof and this bike hasn't got astronomical
mileage on it. so worn rings and/or stem seals isn't what I signed up for

Ah well. I'll start the work tomorrow when brother brings me his workshop
manual For a change it's something that'll be brand new anyway.

 

Ah. From memory, it was questionable pistons and their fit in the
bores. Reports of smoking were widespread in 2001/2002 and gave rise
to the infamous response from SuzukiGB: "Consumption of a litre of
engine oil over a distance of 1000 miles can be considered normal". Or
something like that.

Anyway, there's a link here to a rather wordy but interesting example
of a Bandit with a smoking problem:

http://www.sukbog.co.uk/gallery/misc/lenny/lenny.html

The cast rectangular 'box' that sits in the centre of and on top of the
cam cover. There's a spigot running out of the left side about halfway
along it. The standard breather hose runs straight from that, through
a 90 degree turn rearward, between carbs 2&3 and straight into the
airbox. Total hose length no more than ten inches.

That's cool, man, I can do shiny. No airbox, you gotta do something
with the condensed fume. I've got some canisters full of charcoal in
the back of shed#2 off an American-spec bike that we lightened the
fairing of, if you'd like 'em

 

My Bandit had less than 18,000 on it when the engine finally gave up.
I think that in their original GSXR incarnation they were pretty sound
(for their day and the power they put out) but as soon as people start
dicking around with them it puts undesigned-for stress into them and
they start to fail.

I've got a standard motor in mine now and it does all I need it to: if
I really want a chunk more grunt I'll drop a tooth off a sprocket
first, and failing that I'll stick some Gixer cams and carbs on it.
**** dicking around with ignition advancers and jetting kits and
individual air filters. Or buy a more powerful bike.

It isn't just the motors, though - I'm going to swap my original
gearbox from the blown motor into this one, as the current 'box is
getting severely rattly. The RF900 garden ornament has a dodgy 'box
too - won't stay in second - although that could be a worn selector
which the Gixers were prone to. I've got a complete engine to go in
that, too ... next time Loz wants to borrow my trailer ;-)

Ah, the old "Can you just ... " family/mates approach. Oh, how I love
to hear those words.

 

If you want a set of stem seals, let me know. I am pretty sure I have
a new set left over from a top end gasket set I bought a couple of
years ago.

 

Much appreciated Sir and I'll be contacting you for sure. Well if they need
replacing, that is.


Cheers

 

Well more investigation turned up what I think (hope) is the cause of the
smokiness. Remember, this isn't a high mileage bike (18650) and it's only
been smoking its tits off for a short while, so I doubt it's one of those
Bandit motors that smoked after the initial running in period and it's
simply a case of shite maintenance.

I removed the seat, tank and front fairing and went straight for the easy
bits first. Air filter and plugs. I have to say I've never in my life seen
an air filter as clogged as this one. I suspect it's never been changed
since the bike was bought. Next the plugs. Black as the hobs of hell, all 4
of 'em, so...

Rang brother and told him to get a new air filter and a set of plugs and
before I go any further, they'll be fitted and the bike fired up. I'm of a
mind that the smoking won't be an issue when the fucking engine can breathe
fresh air instead of neat fuel.

This is (apparently) standard apart from the can which is a "Viper" as I
discovered when I got some of the crap off it, so if that's the extent of
the modifying, the worst I can expect is a lean runner, not a rich runner,
but as it's not a mega expensive can, I can't see a re-jet being needed. I
fucking hop not anyway, or I'll be looking for a standard can on th' owd
eBay.

When I last rode this particular Bandit, the 'box was really smooth and
anyway, it's not mine so I don't really give a ****

Not just friends and family either. We get it every day from our trade
customers, along with that other gem: "While you've got paint in the gun,
can you?" as if the fucking paint costs us **** all.

 

That'll certainly help. Dare I ask how long it's been since the oil
was changed?

It won't need jetting. Plug chop it if you want to be sure, but I have
no doubt it'll be fine. However, should you find a need for a standard
can I can certainly lay my hands on a suitable example.

 

You dare and for once, not that long ago. It's still oil coloured as opposed
to black and stinky.

That snippet of info is stored and I thank ewe. Now all I've got to do is
wait for lazy fucker brother to get the bits.

Cheers