New to motorcycle racing...Duhamel vs. Mladin vs. MGP riders?

This might be too much to take on here, but I am hooked on motorcycle racing
and would like to know if Duhamel and Mladin have an off track feud
going(did I actually see Mladin give the ol "up yours" after his close
battle with Duhamel?), as well as if either of them could compete in Moto
GP. My uneducated opinion is that MGP is the premier class, so I wonder if
these guys could hang? If not, how did Edwards, Hayden, Hopkins, Roberts,
get in without as many championships as say Mladin? Is WSBK more competitive
than AMA Superbike? It can't be all rider choice, so is there something
working against these guys? Mladin is going for number 5 in AMA superbike,
so he obviously has talent. Are all the aforementioned US guys in MGP
better? What about E. Bostrom, Zemke, etc. Any chance?

 

Oh jeez, here we go again!

 

Sorry Andrew....I should have known this had been asked before. I will try
to look for some archives.

 

No apologies necessary....it is always an entertaining topic.
I'm kinda new to this group also....Guess what the first thread I jumped in
on was about!

 

I'll let this one pass.

But I can't let this one pass. What have either of them done to justify
this? Let's not forget that Ben had his chance in WSB and didn't do
anything with it apart from a very good run of 5 races in the middle of
his time there. Eric wasn't significantly better or worse than Walker
when they were both on uncompetitive Kawasakis in WSB. And even a
confirmed Walker fan has to admit that he hasn't turned out to be up
there with Xaus-Hodgeson-Bayliss.

Given the weak second half of the field in WSB this year, that's not
saying much.

Like the Bostrom's, based on what?

I really hope he does well. If the track turns out to be a Bridgestone
track then it's great chance to show what he can do, given that
everybody will be starting from nothing on Friday morning.

I guess we won't know.

 

2002. 3rd Hodgeson on a Ducati on Dunlops. Well ahead of Haga on the
Aprilia, a couple of poles and pushing Edwards and Bayliss at several
races. 5th Bostrom on the same level of Ducati on Dunlops. One podium.
One was on his way to a championship and a MotoGP ride. One was on his
way down and back to national championships. It doesn't matter how much
natural talent you've got if you can't show it. If you appear to give
up, nobody's going to give you another ride at world level.

I like Eric B and I hope he finds his way back from this year. But you
often only get one or two shots at getting noticed. There are some
parallels here with Sean Emmett. He's had some days when he's unbeatable
and others that were appalling. And this year he's really struggled on
the 999 too.

Of those, I rate Xaus, McWilliams and Byrne although McWilliams is
clearly at the end of a tough career entirely on un-competitive
machinery. Abe and Aoki have had days when they've been as fast as
anyone in MotoGP but neither have done much lately. So for those 5 I
don't think it's at all obvious that Yates is better. Xaus and Byrne
haven't yet shown their real ability in MotoGP but Xaus has been getting
better and better and managed a 2nd in the WSB championship. Byrne
demolished BSB and demolished the field as a wild card in WSB. Yates is
where? 8th? in AMA this year, all be it with 2 non starts but on the
same bike as the guy who's likely to win the championship?

No, just reality. Imagining what Mladin *might* do *if* he got a series
of wild card rides in MotoGP is to live in cloud cuckoo land. It's like
being the winning-est rider ever in WSB and imagining that you are a
better rider than Doohan. ;^)

 

You know the problem with all this historical analysis is that it's too
easy to end up comparing riders at different stages of their careers.
Xaus is still young and I think he's still improving. In '02 he had the
raw speed but was still crashing too often; still learning. In '02,
Bostrom had enough experience, had showed enough ability in the past and
was on a good enough team that he should have been top Dunlop runner.
But he wasn't and by some way. So one was on the up-curve and the other
was on the down curve. Nobody's going to employ someone who looks like
they are past their best. If he was going to revive his career by a
spell in a National championship, he needed to dominate it. And he
hasn't done that either.

And then, to some extent, riders are only as good as their last race.
That Yates or Eric B were really fast last year or the year before makes
no never mind unless there's a good reason for it and they're seen to be
trying. Which reminds me. Why is Kenny Roberts Jr still in MotoGP?

"The older I get, the faster I was".

Off topic. I find it quite amusing to see Proton and WCM offering rides
to all sorts for one off rides. Yuichi Ui? James Haydon? As long as you
don't end up in a Jamie Witham fireball it must be quite a laugh to
thrash an un-competitive but still scarily fast bike round with the
MotoGP boys. No pressure except to use your mirrors in the last third of
the race. Pray for rain and you might even get in the top 10.

 

Pure provocation or your forgot the past tense??

 

I prefer to wait for the end of the season to have some conclusion but I
keep in mind that the best way to compare riders is with their teammate...
As I said I'm sure Nicky and Colin will there next year but they will have
probably to lower their salary...
Up to now Tamada has 2 wins while earning probably 3 or 4 times less money
than Nicky.

 

WTF??? Time travel maybe? ;-P

-Chris-

 

They way you lay it out it sounds like Bridgstone with a large margin must
be the best tires out there. A no name came out of nowhere and won, _only_
because of the tires.
That said I kind of agree, the tires peobably helped at those three tracks,
but the guy has to be fast, not? None of the Suzukis has been close, except
for at the pointless qualification. He beats everyone, on any tires, so I
think he earns the credit of being one of the guys that must be evaluated
for a top honda seat. Before that would happen I'm sure they will do some
testing with other tires on his bike.

 

There is one factor missing here. How good/bad are the bridgestones compared
to the michelins. Could it be that they are only as god as Michlins at their
best or are they better?
We can only asume they are better at those few occations, and a little worse
at normal conditions, but we don't know, do we? Could it be that Tamada is
the best we got out there and that the suzukis are quite competetive given
the right tires?

Well, it shouldn't be to hard to bring his team mate with him for testing.
Whatever I might think of Biaggi as championship material he is, as you
pointed out a methodical, consistent work horse and at the same time fast
enough to be a good benchmark for Tamada.

Sure he, or some japanese get a seat with Honda, question is how far away
from HRC.

 

To be honest, that speculation is right there together with a few of your
own.
Maybe a little further out. Yes, you usually base them on historical facts,
but fortunatly history proves wrong quite often I just find it typical
that you take for granted that there is a fixed rating between the two tires
putting the bike/rider combination into some other rating (adjusted for bike
improvment), based on..., I don't know what.

Eh, do we know that Tamada will go to the factory team? Do we know that
Biaggi won't?
Anyway, sure Honda would be able to get one of their existing riders to
compare with Tamada on a track that they both know and what ever their times
used to be could be compared in a Michelin Michelin/Bridgestone test. Isn't
his the kind of stuff they usually do off season?

As you said, we'll see. I'm not surprised if your right but that will have
to wait, doesn't it. BTW, are you suggesting that Honda can't do the math on
the tire equation and that the victory is so graete that it stand on its own
without evaluation?

/MBE