not so much a willy willy....

Zebee wrote -

This thread reminds me of some unfinished business with most bike
manufacturers.

Our species arrives in various configurations which requires manufacturers
of things that have to fit humans to either make a variety of sizes or make
the item adjustable in key dimensions.

Best example is road (push) bikes - with some fiddling, pretty much any size
human can be accommodated in the most efficient peddling position (leaving
aside the many theories of where that is exactly).

They seem to have got this pretty much nailed in cars.

But if your at the other end of the spectrum to Betty (a way tall boofy
bloke) forget a Ducati monster or most of the smaller sports bikes because
the cramping means someone like me will never fit (and I did like the
monster).

I appreciate some of the smarter manufacturers (bmw for one) do have
variable seats and lowering / raising bits.

But, imho, most manufacturers could do a hell of a lot better - apart from
it being safer for the operator, they might sell more units.

 

In aus.motorcycles on Mon, 26 Jan 2009 08:29:02 +1100

Umm... how many frame sizes are there again?

(And I note that in the 1980s I had one hell of a time finding a
pushbike to fit, as apparently only people under 10 or over 5'8" rode
bicycles...)

NOt many variables need to change and those that do aren't part of the
main configuration of the vehicle.

However... most car seatbelt configs range from uncomfortable to
dangerous for me. I've met plenty of cars where it's hard for me to
have the pedals close enough without the steering wheel hitting me in
the face, and where my vision isn't as good as it could be as I'm too
low in the seat.

Most of it's in the main config of the bike.

In the same way road style bicycles have really high bottom brackets
so that if you have the pedal/seat distance correct you have to lean
the bike well over or get off the seat when you stop (If you want
your foot flat that is) modern motorcycles tend to have engine and
pegs high for ground clearance. This makes the seat high too.

My beloved and much missed 850T Guzzi was one of the lowest bikes
I've ever ridden. The engine and frame design was lovely but had
drawbacks such as a much longer wheelbase than is currently desired.

HOw do you suggest they do that?

What sells bikes and who to?

I am not sure... according to the adverts the manufacturers believe
that what sells bikes is fantasy - racing or outlaw. And they sell to
men. If they are right, then they don't really need to make a bike
that fits small people, they need to spend more effort on one that
fits taller ones as the average male height is increasing.

Read the magazine reviews. Over the years I (being short) have
noticed that the main complaint magazine testers have is the bike's
too *cramped*. For some reason they are tall and so complain about
that. The only time they ever have a shorter person test is when they
do one of those condescending "woman's view" things. (Hven't done for
some time that I've seen, guess they finally got the message it's
condescending, but not the corrolary of "so have female testers for
things that aren't fscking scooters")

Car manufacturers can have adjustments because the driver position
changes are minor in the scheme of how the car is made. Bike position
changes are much bigger (and I suspect more expensive).

You can muck about at the edges some if you have a fairly standard shaped
bike - can do a little with seat height (but not much because of frame
requirements), a little with peg location on eccentric adjusters on
pegs and levers (but not that much ), a little with adjustable bars
(and I'd like to see this on more bikes although the BMW version I've
seen is truly ugly) but must be careful with fairings and cables/hoses.

Given the complexity of bike adjustment (you'll note the cost of the
bikes these are available on) I'd bet that you won't see them on
anything but top end tourers.

Zebee
- whose Norge has adjustable pegs and foot and hand controls but
*really* needs adjustable bars.

 

There are situations (rare) where I've been concerned about gusting
wind. And that's when the gusts are changing direction and strong. I
can flatfoot both feet so can certainly understand where a shortarse
is going to have that situation more often.

 

GSX-R1000 comes with 3 position adjustable pegs/levers.

Nev..
'07 XB12X
'08 DL1000K8

 

Nah - that's just for the wank factor. "Man, I have to have the pegs
up so high as I keep getting my knee sliders down on the road just
going to the shopping centre".

I recall following a guy on a GSXR750 kitted out in full Dainese
coloured leathers who I could tell was starting to get pissed off with
me following him on a VTX1800 which I hadn't ridden before and had
borrowed off a mate. First time I had ridden a bike that had feet
forward rather than back. I knew I had got to cornering limits when my
boots hit the road rather than the pegs. A mate of mine made the
comment that the only time your feet should be forward is just before
you crash . . .

But it was quite interesting to have your feet hit the ground at
fairly low speed compared to the Busa.

 

That's happened to me twice on the '01 FZ1 (220kg +) and both times it was
when encountereing unexpected slipperiness mid corner and having a mild
front wheel skid, fortunately at very low speed both times and probably a
lot of luck and a bit of instinct saved a low side. Certainly didn't
conciously realise what had happened until after the event, but the boot
hitting the ground was quite disconcerting. A totally different sensation
to the peg scraping which I managed on the same bike during an advanced
skills course riding around Hidden Valley Raceway. I doubt I could
(certainly wouldn't want to) achieve that on an ordinary road.

P

 

Is that opinion based on some personal experience with current model
GSXR1000s or something else? I only know about the adjustable
pegs/levers because a mate who owns one reckons the option to drop the
pegs to improve ergonomics was great. I'm slightly more inclined to
listen to the opinion of someone who owns one, than someone who doesn't
own any bikes.

Nev..
'07 XB12X
'08 DL1000K8

 

It was me being somewhat facetious actually.

 

In aus.motorcycles on Mon, 2 Feb 2009 05:20:15 +1100

Depends.

Oddly enough, mostly I balance the bike between both feet. If I need
to slide down to put one foot down more I do, but get right back up to
balancing on both.

THis is because I've had too many bikes lean one way then the
other....

Zebee

 

Yup and the process of sliding across the seat to get the other foot
down can mean the bike is a long way over before you have footing (read
as "oops damn glad i bought those oggy knobs")

JL