[QUOTE] Speedgazebo MOTP #1 wrote: snip Leather costs money. Skin heals for free. [/QUOTE] Indeed it does, but the health care (if NHS) is only free at the point of delivery if the injury is bad enough to require professional health care then it costs the NHS lots. Yes I know we all pay our taxes and risk is a personal thing, so don't have a problem with people's own decisions but body repairs are expensive and bloody painful. If Champ's repairs a couple of years ago were on the NHS I wonder what they amounted to. I celebrate his freedom to choose to race and am sorry it went the way that it did, sounded like the health care was good, am very pleased he is now well enough to race again and wish him all the best this week, by the way what is Champ's name so I can keep an eye open for him on the tele coverage. Decades back I used to ride as described, but in those days we called trainers plimsoles. I never ever ride without the jacket or gloves and hardly ever without the leggings. All down to a physiotherapist friend who told me about degloveing injuries she had seen following bikes accidents; see link of what I believe is an extreme example but certainly made me think more than twice. [URL]http://www.orthogate.org/cases/hand-and-wrist/degloving-forearm-injury.html[/URL] Still as has been said if it makes you ride more carefully the risks must be reduced, but I bet that doesn't make the injury any less if it does happen. So says the whimp on a dullsville. Brian