Skidding

Hello all.

That horrid cold wet and windy time of the year is back again, leaves
falling from trees, mud in the road and all that nice stuff.

This will be my first biking winter, and even though I did all of my
training when it was snowing earlier on this year that was all on a
rather upright 125.

This morning I was chuffing along on my way to work on the A20 (my
preferred crashing spot for cars and bikes alike) and on a very modest
curve in the road the bike did a wee skid. I noticed there was mud in
the road, but there wasn't much but the leaves gave it a bit of back
up.

It felt like the rear moved to the left and the bike wobbled in a
generally unstable fashion, I reduced the throttle a bit (but still
gave it a small amount of power) then kicked it up a gear and carried
on to work in an uneventful fashion.

Apart from leaving the bike at home and taking a car to work, what is
the best thing to do when unintentional skidding or sliding takes
place. Reduce throttle, leave it the same? In addition to going more
slowing would putting the bike in a higher gear reduce the risk of
skidding?

Thanks.

 

Hello all.

1 Countersteer
2 Pile on the power
3 Stick boot down on the side lowest to ground
4 Powerslide around the corner like a Stadium rider on 2 wheels and a leg
5 stop at next services for pants change

I don't intend or ever want to try it but it does look good on Speedway
;-)


--



Robbo
Trophy 1200 1998
BotaFOF #19. E.O.S.M 2001/2002/2003/2004/2005
B.O.S.M 2003, 2004, 2005
FURSWB#1 KotL..YTC449
PM#7
..

 

BGN emerged from their own little world to say

Plan A:

Observation is key.

Go slower so you see the hazard AND have time to react appropriately.

Plan B

Go much faster. The likelihood of suffering pain when you crash is
minimised.

 

On Friday 14 October 2005 17:28, BGN() wrote in

Relax.

 

Learn to be less hamfisted, in a nutshell.

I tend to automatically drop into a smoother style of riding, when the roads
are wet / covered in mud / I spot rather more gravel mid bend, than I'd
prefer.

And as for leaving it in a higher gear, that's a definite no - when you're
in a lower gear, you'll get more engine braking - this helps in two ways:

* Any braking you then do with the back brake, has more engine force to
overcome, before it can lock the back wheel up.

* It's a more gentle way of scrubbing off speed in some ways, than prodding
furiously at the brakes.

Others may disagree - I *personally*, have managed to avoid lobbing it big
style in the wet since my formative, riding mopeds and 125s, years, so read
into that, what you will. ;-)

Try and keep it sunny side up for more than a few days, eh.

 

In uk.rec.motorcycles, BGN amazed us all with this pearl of wisdom:

IME doing nothing has saved me from binning it. You could try sticking
your leg out or put your foot on the ground (which saved me once) but I
only really notice it after it's happened.

 

Leave the throttle alone works best for me; don't open it, don't close
it, just leave it where it is. Unless you get really unlucky and
encounter several yards of muck and shite (or diesel...) then these
sorts of moments are usually over before the brain has an opportunity to
do anything about it, anyway.

Of course, if we're talking really lurid, arse-end waaay out of line
with the front-type skids then gas it, 'cause it's 50/50 you're going to
come off anyway.


And having the front skidding as well is usually a trip to A&E unless
you're Nicky Hayden or Valentino Rossi. I've only had this happen twice,
both times on the BMW on 020's when I was pushing a little harder than
perhaps I ought. It was a little, um, disconcerting but it stayed put
and just meant my exit line was about a foot further out than I'd
intended. Fortunately, both times was over here and on right-handers.

 

I fail to see how using engine braking prevents the rear wheel locking
up.

 

Don't do it.

When you wanna come....

--
Dan L (Oldbloke)

My bike 1996 Kawasaki ZR1100 Zephyr
M'boy's bike 2003 Honda NSR125R (Going)
Spare Bike 1990 Suzuki TS50X (Patio Ornament)
BOTAFOT #140 (KotL 2005), X-FOT#000, DIAABTCOD #26, BOMB#18 (slow)

 

IIRC from my car driving lessons I was advised to start off in a high
gear if the road was likely to help with skidding. For example
starting off in 2nd gear instead of 1st. I normally do 30mph in 2nd
gear on the bike, but it certainly doesn't mind doing it in 3rd gear.
On a slippery surface could skidding/loss of rear traction be caused
by going in 2nd gear as there's more torque than in 3rd? Or would the
benefits of engine braking over sticking on the normal brakes in this
situation outweigh any advantages?

Perhaps I'm over thinking this again.

 

You're prolly not, but you are using a poor comparator.

Using a higher gear for the same road speed in order to reduce rpm and
therefore the quantity of torque applied to the driving wheel(s) works
for a car, but on a bike may cause a stall and then over you go.

Personally I have always practiced progressive throttle control and in
the winter my entire throttle use becomes very delicate and only
extends to about half of the available travel. So much so, that I
realise Summer has arrived when I rediscover the other half of the
throttle. I would never advocate use of a higher gear, preferring to
retain control under my right hand (or foot) rather than the
ever-clumsy left foot.

Be gentle with the controls, relax and remain ever-watchful for
treacherous surfaces and the natural traps - under trees lurk wet
leaves, damp patches or even algal slime/moss - and in Winter frost
patches that the sun never gets to.

 

BGN says...

My Gixer Thou will happily pull away smoothly from 30mph in 5th. A
smaller bike should be able to do this quite happily too. There's no
need to be in as low a gear as 2nd at 30mph.

--
Lozzo
Track pixie
GSX-R1000 K1
ZX-7R
GPZ500S

 

It'll quite happily do it, but I always seem to keep the revs up.
Dunno why, I did it on my Cat-A test and the examiner didn't care. I'm
not sure if it's a good or a bad thing.

 

Being in too tall a gear will mean you've got the throttle a bit too wide
open. This won't be a problem until you lose traction, and the back wheel
spins up...

 

Most people come off because they instinctively shut the
throttle. This loads the front as the weight dives forward
and can cause the front to lose traction as it can't handle
putting 100% of the traction through the front tyre.

Keep on a positive throttle and ride it out. The rear will
grip as it clears whatever caused the slide and you'll
still be going in the right direction. Not panicing is
the best way to go.

Wet road surfaces are not inherantly slippery, and it takes
quite a bit of throttle chopping to get it to break traction
in a messy way. Be smooth and you'll be fine.

 

whipping the clutch in and throttle on tick over has helped me out off road
a few times, and on road where the surface was pretty porridge. Feel where
the bike wants to go and feed in power where it needs it. I never had to put
a foot on the floor, I reckon that upsets the balance and it looks naff,
just like the guys who accelerate from the lights with feet dangling for
half a mile.

 

wessie wrote

Ho yuss. Be observant, put a trauma nurse on the dole.

That and relax.

 

If you're running with a shut throttle, from higher revs, the braking effect
is better than that, if you were in a higher gear - the engine is thus,
providing more resistance to the momentum you have, and you slow down
quicker.

Now... if you then brake hard up to a certain level of applied force, the
engine braking will assist in slowing you down quicker - go past this point,
and within reason, the flywheel effect of the engine will then be greater
than it would be if revving lower, in a higher gear - net result is, unless
you really take the piss, the rear wheel locks up less easily due to
excessively applied braking, because of the greater resistance the engine
giving.

It's not a rule as such, and this is where having half a clue on how to read
the road and conditions unfolding out in front of you reasonably well, comes
in...

 

JackH emerged from their own little world to say

I've read this twice. I'm sure you know what you mean but it is meaningless
gibberish.

We've covered this already.

 

There's an 'is' missing, just before the 'giving' right at the end. ;-)