Where can we get statistics of which BIKES pass the California DMVriding test?

Discussion in 'Bay Area Bikers' started by JoeSchmoe, Sep 12, 2010.

  1. JoeSchmoe

    ? Guest

    Oh, yes. That reminds me of the first student pilot who told me about
    "turns around a point."

    He turned out to be gay...
    ?, Sep 15, 2010
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  2. JoeSchmoe

    Twibil Guest

    Um-hum. But isn't it a bit odd how all the people you've ever known
    have turned out to be gay?

    I mean, given that the odds are less than one in ten, you'd think that
    at least a *few* of your friends would have been straight; but I
    suppose it's a case of "like attracts like".
    Twibil, Sep 15, 2010
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  3. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    Hi Tim,
    How is that sour grapes? I passed the MSF riding test. Easily. Why would
    I have sour grapes about that? They gave me a free pass for my license.
    All I had to do was wait a few months to get into the class and pay $200
    for the free license.

    I can even pass the California DMV test, sometimes. Not many. But some
    times. Even when I'm not the judge - because the only way to know (since
    you can't even SEE the lines) is to have someone else grade you.

    That still doesn't change the fact that the DMV test is designed to
    funnel people into the MSF class and that bigger bore bikes will have a
    difficult time circling an outside radius of 21 feet 9 inches every
    single time with zero errors allowed in both directions after and before
    gentle swerving and straightaways.

    Since we don't seem to have ANY statistics for ANY state for which bikes
    passed/failed their respective DMV tests, we're all guessing.

    And, guess what. My guess is as good as yours (sans data).
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  4. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    I don't recall ever saying "DMV class" (please show where it was said by
    me); but if I did, it was a typo. There's an MSF class; but not a DMV

    Just like there's a DMV riding test; and an MSF riding test.

    I already explained that I've taken both riding tests. They have NOTHING
    in common (as copiously explained already).

    Why do you think they have nothing in common?

    The only way these two tests could have nothing in common, is if they are
    designed to funnel people from one to the other. You fail the DMV test,
    you pass the MSF test. It's that simple.

    But, don't take it from me. If we had the statistics, they'd show what
    I'm saying incontrovertibly.

    I'll wager the statistics will conclusively show that larger bore bikes
    VERY OFTEN fail the DMV riding test. And, that almost everyone passes the
    MSF riding test (after paying the MSF over $200 for the privilege) on
    those tiny toy bikes.
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  5. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    Hi Bob,
    I think you totally missed the point.

    The post you're referring to was contrasting the DMV riding test with the
    MSF riding test realism.

    Are you actually saying the DMV riding test is more realistic than the MSF
    riding test?

    I can't believe that since NOBODY else has ever said that (nor will they).

    What ARE you trying to say about the difference between the DMV riding
    test and the MSF riding test?

    And, what has that got to do with the statistics of which bikes pass?
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  6. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    Hi Beav,

    First of all, whether the rider passes or fails, the bike is logged.
    The DMV told me it's for statistics; and I'm trying to get those

    As for WHY anyone would want statistics ... you're joking right?

    I'm sure there isn't a business in the world that doesn't do some kind of
    basic statistics on their customers. For a DMV, it's a basic statistic
    what bikes show up, which pass, which fail.

    I can see a LOT of information coming out of those statistics that the DMV
    would find useful (and dangerous were we to know them).

    For example, if you saw that 99% of the K1200RS riders failed the test,
    wouldn't it tell you something. Especially if 99% of the Goldwing riders
    (if this group can be believed) passed it?

    The DMV, while still being a government agency, is definitely not stupid.
    They are keeping good statistics. And they're reporting those statistics
    to SOMEONE within the DMV (and likely to the MSF also).

    The quest is to get a hold of those statistics. I'm sure it will make a
    liar out of a lot of us! I, for one, am not afraid of the facts.
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  7. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    OK. I found where it was. It's clearly a typo. There was a paragraph
    about the DMV test and the MSF test. In the paragraph of the MSF test, I
    contrasted the MSF test with the DMV test. During one of the contrasts, I
    accidentally typed 'class' instead of 'test'.

    Wow. Picky group. You'd think you could tell from the content and context
    that I clearly meant DMV test ... but hey, I typed it so I'll take the

    I apologize. Yes. You are right. There is no "DMV class". It was all a
    huge mistake on my part. You are correct. I am sorry.

    Now back to those statistics ... don't we have them ... for ANY state????
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  8. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    What do you find so arrogant?

    I've simply asked "where can we find the statistics" for any state.

    Nobody has the answer.

    Yet, they (you) attack the bearer of the question.

    Your intellect obviously must tell you something, otherwise you wouldn't
    have said what you did. That's fine. That's what a USENET discussion is
    all about. Polite people having discussions.

    But, I can't tell from your response what your intellect is telling us.

    So I must ask directly:

    What do YOU think these statistics would tell us?
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 15, 2010
  9. JoeSchmoe

    Twibil Guest

    (And that, BTW, was another lie. The MSF course doesn't ever "pass
    everyone". Never has. You really don't seem to understand the
    difference between truth [which refers to *real* things] and lies;
    which are things that you make up; and which *aren't* real.)
    No, that's just another self-serving lie; told by someone who can
    apparently rationalize just about anything. So into the Bozo Bin with

    You'll like it there.
    Twibil, Sep 15, 2010
  10. <Wearily>

    Who cares?
    The Older Gentleman, Sep 15, 2010
  11. JoeSchmoe

    Twibil Guest

    Um, no. No it isn't.

    Despite your quaint egalitarian notion that your opinion is just as
    good as anyone's, in the real world we go to doctors when we're sick,
    we go to structural engineers if we need to build a bridge, and we go
    ask MSF instructors when we need valid opinions on how and why the MSF

    Q: Have you been an MSF instructor as Tim was for quite some while?

    Then he knows what he's talking about, and you don't.
    Twibil, Sep 15, 2010
  12. JoeSchmoe

    Tim Guest

    No, it is *not* an MSF class.

    1. The California Motorcyclist Safety Program is administered by the
    California Highway Patrol pursuant to California Vehicle Code section
    2931, which established permanent funding for the program in 1994

    It is NOT administered by the MSF. The MSF does not administer state
    rider training programs, to my knowledge. It provides curricula and
    "Rider Coach" certification.

    2. The Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) is a national, not-for-
    profit organization promoting the safety of motorcyclists with
    programs in rider training, operator licensing and public information.
    The MSF is sponsored by the U.S. manufacturers and distributors of
    BMW, Ducati, Harley-Davidson, Honda, Kawasaki, KTM, Piaggio/Vespa,
    Suzuki, Triumph, Victory and Yamaha motorcycles. The Motorcycle
    Safety Foundation (MSF) is a developer of rider training curricula and
    public information campaigns for motorcyclists.

    It is NOT funded by the California Motorcyclist Safety Program

    3. Your six-year vendetta has been exposed. Get a life.
    Tim, Sep 15, 2010
  13. JoeSchmoe

    Tim Guest

    Of course you're not. You have been on this quixotic "quest" for at
    least six years, maybe longer!
    Tim, Sep 15, 2010
  14. JoeSchmoe

    Tim Guest

    I don't have any idea. Nor do I care.

    My intellect is making me ask why you have consistently ignored the
    FACTS that the MSF is NOT profiting from the California Motorcyclist
    Safety Program, and continue to insist on calling the CMSP classes
    "MSF classes" and continue to propogate the erroneous idea that the
    student tuition paid to the CHP-administered California Motorcyclist
    Saftey Program rider training programs is paid to, and enriches, the
    Motorcycle Safety Foundation.
    Tim, Sep 15, 2010
  15. JoeSchmoe

    ? Guest

    At least you *hope* so. Isn't that why you keep on corresponding with
    me, due to the catamite factor that runs in your Carr family line?
    ?, Sep 15, 2010
  16. JoeSchmoe

    ? Guest

    Picking statements apart to find errors and avoid agreeing with other
    users is what rec.motorcycles is all about, it's what these people
    *do* for a hobby.
    ?, Sep 15, 2010
  17. JoeSchmoe

    Twibil Guest

    Idiot, there's no such things as a family lineage that hasn't featured
    a percentage of gays; and that includes *your* lineage.

    Yes, even your fictional one.
    Twibil, Sep 15, 2010
  18. JoeSchmoe

    Bob Myers Guest

    Do you have a problem with reading comprehension? The point was the
    "realism," per se, is IRRELEVANT.

    Bob M.
    Bob Myers, Sep 16, 2010
  19. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    His words say otherwise ...
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 17, 2010
  20. JoeSchmoe

    JoeSchmoe Guest

    My buddies are just like you. :)

    They all told me to forget about it. They said the system is rigged. They
    all said don't even try to change it or get around it. Just do it. They
    all told me to just pay the $250 for the guaranteed license. They joked
    it was a bribe to the MSF to let you ride on the road.

    Some told me to just consider it a $250 license fee, only you pay the MSF
    instead of paying the DMV. So what, they all said.

    While you, and they, didn't care, I'll bet some of the 10,000 California
    riders a year who are forced to pay $250 for a license might care.
    JoeSchmoe, Sep 17, 2010
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