Why are we still alive

In aus.motorcycles on Tue, 21 Apr 2009 14:45:15 -0700 (PDT)

I haven't been out where I can really experiment yet, but some messing
about on the commute shows that "it depends".

Most of the time I'm push/pull, bracing with the left foot when
pulling on the left bar and with the right foot when pushing on the
left bar.

Sometimes, mostly on slower turns with less oomph required, I pushed
on the right bar.

Zebee

 

You've missed my input. I use both push and pull simultaneously.

Theo

 

Push one bar and pull the other bar whilst bracing with the foot
opposite the push bar is exactly what I do when I want maximum speed of
tip in, but that's restricted to track days.

It also has the advantage that those forces act to shift my body towards
the inside of the bike where it needs to be anyway.


G-S

 

Sorry mate, you'll have to go re-do that test then

The two options were push left / push right to go left and right
respectively, and putting all the input into the left bar only - push
left bar to go left, pull left bar to go right. The push/pull on the
left keeping you off the right bar for smoother throttle control

Pull / pull seems to have no real advantage to me.

It's definitely opposite brace for push, I *think* it might be same
side brace for pull but I'd have to actually go for a ride to be sure.

JL

 

JL wrote:

No thanks!

I hate riding and trying out something.

When I have to actually think about what I am doing it makes it too much
like working.

Ah, OK, I understand what you are getting at, and, if it works for you,
essentially steering with the left hand only, bloody good luck to you.

You are younger than I am, and can probably handle such new-fangled
ideas, but I will stick with the simple stuff I know, and push with the
appropriate hand.

As I said, it seems likely that it would work well with a FF rig with
high bars.....anyone want to lend me such a bike to try it? ;-)

On my bikes, it just feels wrong.

Well, what are you waiting for..... oops, sorry, I remember now. ;-)

How goes the paternity bit?

regards,
CrazyCam

 

In relation to the one arm comment I originally made, I've been to
Borders and found the text I was referring too.
Titled "Total Control - High Performance Street Riding Techniques" Lee
Parks 2003 $49.95.... Page 21 states "I am a firm believer when
cornering you should only use your inside arm to steer". "This includes
both the pushing and pulling when appropriate". Reading further
indicates no input from the outer arm at all.

I note other books there only ever mention push. Pull never gets a mention.

I have looked at Codes, Twist of the Wrist II and lost the plot as I
felt it was too track oriented with all the markers and geometry and
apexes. All the theory pointed to getting the same corner perfect over
and over through line, braking and speed as in on a track. Bloody hard
to map out a corner on a country road on one run through. And, I don't
recall any discussion on push or pull or both.

Your comment "Why are you still pulling the bike down if you're
accelerating out of the corner?" probably says I've poorly related what
I'm doing.

My comment re Mt Nebo/Glorious wasn't meant I'll be watching others,
bugger that. I meant I'll be thinking what I'm doing (chicken dance!).
I'm more conscious now that most reading of push steering is in books
where the example is using low bars and the rider is very much forward
position. I suspect this is a lot of the basis for the push, versus pull.

MikeH

 

"Total Control - High Performance Street Riding Techniques" Lee Parks
2003 $49.95
Page 21 states "I am a firm believer when cornering you should only use
your inside arm to steer". "This includes both the pushing and pulling
when appropriate".
Reading further indicates no input from the outer arm at all. An
interesting read. Let us know what you think of it.
MikeH

 

Add me to push/push.

Bill

 

You need a (don't call them cruise-controls) friction device on your
throttle Iain.
I've done a lot of left-hand-throttle riding too and it's not to be
recommended!

 

My mind is boggling trying to imagine why you'd ever need to "pull" with
your inside arm when cornering!! (unless you had Ape-hangers or something)
When I'm cornering the 'bars are trying to turn in and I'm pushing to hold
them out.

 

It makes more sense than your original statement of not 'pulling and
pushing at the same time". So he's not talking about doing both actions
at once, he's talking about which arm is steering.. ie once you commence
a steering action for a corner, all subsequent steering inputs for that
action are performed by the same arm. I haven't ridden my bike since
reading that paragraph above, but I believe that is the way I steer in a
corner, though I rarely ever give it much conscious thought.

Nev..
'07 XB12X
'08 DL1000K8

 

And the *glaven*...

 

Jeez Nev, I don't have much trouble understanding what I was saying, and
your a lot smarter than me!
Sometimes, the way people say things is more curious than what their
saying.
MikeH

 

what are you on about ?

Nev..
'07 XB12X
'08 DL1000K8

 

Like you, I tend to do most push-pull with my left hand. I haven't
always done it this way. It's a (bad) habit I seem to have developed
over time. The inadvertant consequences have been that I now lean
shoulder first INTO a left hand corner, but tend to haul the bike over
and lean back into right hand corners - with the result that my right
hand cornering is no longer as effective as it once was.

I'm now in the process of trying to break that habit - but it's bloody hard.

 

I must admit I never was taught countersteering. You just worked it
out for yourself and I find I just don't really think about it. The
exception to that I found was when I was really starting to hook into
it and as was starting to climb off the side of the bike it would tend
to be a pull. Rest of the time I really couldn't tell you what I'd be
doing.

 

Aha! THAT explains (maybe) why I'm scrapping the pegs more often on the
RHS even though I'm not RH cornering as well as I should.

It's beginning to make more sense now.